freelance 101
pokie (1198 pencils) | Tue, 2008-01-01 16:41K, I have a billion questions, you already know that. Sorry if it's getting annoying, but I figure you guys are happy to help... right? :) Right!
I am meeting with a client (he wants a web site for his church), he's already seen my work and is hiring me based on it, sometime probably this week. We have had conflicting schedules for the last week or so. I am wondering, what the crap happens at the first meet up? He's already pretty much hired me so I don't really need to take a portfolio.
I figured I'd find out what all he wants on his site, determine the number of pages, etc... then go home, email him a price, and go from there? Is that right? I guess I'm relying on him having a bunch of crap ready for me when I get there. Then I'll have the problem of figuring out how much to charge this dude!
I SUCK at the businessy-stuff. Gonna have to suck it up, I suppose!
Commenting on this Forum topic is closed.
A great discussion here on the topic:
http://creativebits.org/designers_what_to_charge
Bottom line, charging is very arbitrary but there are some factors to narrow it down; you've got some of them already:
Think ahead too. Who's hosting the site? How much web space will they need? Do they need flash and/or database work done on the site down the road? Make sure you open new revenue streams. Yes, it's a church, but churches have money too these days. They are big time marketers!
For inspiration, check out the ChurchMedia.cc website. It's awesome!
Not a full list, but should help you have a productive meeting. :) Make sure you bring pen and paper, ask lots of questions but above all listen to the client. He/she wants the site, it's almost a done deal, you just have to do the design and prep work to make it happen. You can do it. That's why they are hiring you. :)
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Powerpoint is not a design application
My latest web design work
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Dirt and Rust
Definitely have a contract ready for them to sign, and expect that they give you some sort of deposit up front—whether it's 33% or 50% (I require half up front). If you don't have that, then you can get screwed in the long run.
Right now, I am in the process of being hired to do a logo for a local organization for the homeless here in my area, and they're eager for me to get this logo designed and rolling, however, I won't start anything until they sign a contract and give me a deposit up front. I've been screwed once before and that's all it took!
You live and learn.
suzanne maestri-walters :: graphic designer :: www.onegirlcreative.com
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"I am not sick. I am broken. But I am happy as long as I can paint." ~ Frida Kahlo
www.onegirlcreative.com
So, lets say I've got this contract all typed out for them. Do I fill in the price on the line while I'm there with them based on what they need? Or, can I email it to them and have them email me back saying this is okay? I would think an emailed contract is just as good as a signed one. Right?
I just know how I am... I tend to charge way too little when I'm asked on the spot.
I definitely won't start working until I get a guaranteed set price.
Thanks for your help!!!!!
Remember also to have your contract have two tick boxes, ESTIMATE and INVOICE. Keep it an open estimate till the job's done, then it's an Invoice. That way, if the scope increases, you don't have to open a new estimate.
This first contract, do everything in pen, blue, so you get the signatures and sign offs on the work to be done and fill in totals. Prepare your numbers ahead of time, but be flexible. Never show your price before you get as much from the client as possible. Let them tell you their budget first. The more info you get the more bargaining power you will have as well.
After that, the final contract invoice and every update or change on that job can be electronic. I fill in the person's name and date in the invoice when I send that along with the request for final payment (usually net 15 days) and a thank you for the business and suggestion for future work.
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Powerpoint is not a design application
My latest web design work
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Dirt and Rust
Awesome, thanks.
How exactly do you ask them what their budget is. They may ask me for instance... how much would a logo cost... What do you say? Depends on how much money you have... LOL
Just add the budget question to your list and then ask the client how much they have allocated in their budget for the year for this project. That's usually part of the sales negotiation for design work.
The whole thing with sales is to make sure you get all the information first before 'exposing your position' so to speak. If they ask you how much a logo costs, turn it around (not to be evasive, but to gather more information) and find out where they are headed and what they need. Part of your info gathering is to determine where they want to go as a company and what then can afford.
In the interest of listening you're also building a sales strategy and a more firm idea of what pricing is acceptable for your sales pitch.
A company that wants to stay small would have a logo equivalent to that in research and time spent. A larger company, or one headed there, will need to spend more on their logo. This has to do with trademark research on uspto.gov etc. This is true for any work you do for this client: What's the present and future usage going to be?
Find out all you can, THEN talk about pricing.
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Powerpoint is not a design application
My latest web design work
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Dirt and Rust
cool, thanks! I really appreciate the help.
No prob. I found a great freelance rate calculator. Try it!
It's not ironclad, but helps you see where you are professionally. Don't forget what your market will bear will make that figure go lower or higher (or stay the same).
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Powerpoint is not a design application
My latest web design work
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Dirt and Rust
nice!
This way, it means you both have agreed on a fee, and BOTH of you are signing a contract—which protects both parties involved.
Personally? I wouldn't send them my contract via e-mail, because—and I'm not a lawyer (but I play one on TV—LOL)—I would think, if they haven't signed it, there's no protection. I guess if you/them wanted it quickly enough, you could fax it and they could fax back to you with their signature.
If you guys haven't agreed upon a fee, then fill it out in front of them so both parties will agree on your fee. And there won't be any questions or second guesses down the road.
That's my opinion. Hope it works for you!
Suzanne
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"I am not sick. I am broken. But I am happy as long as I can paint." ~ Frida Kahlo
www.onegirlcreative.com
How much to charge
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Powerpoint is not a design application
My latest web design work
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Dirt and Rust
Here is a link to some forms that may help you on the way...
http://www.creativelatitude.com/links/resources_downloads.html
Thanks for your help everyone! I'll let you know how it goes...
Uhm... yeah. This is really awkward. I think they were expecting it for free. It's not worth it to go into the details, but obviously I am losing sleep over it!
Nice. Another church pretending it doesn't have any money.
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Powerpoint is not a design application
My latest web design work
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Dirt and Rust