Illustrator CS2 files - exporting as 600dpi tiffs - problems with linked photoshop files
jude66 (11 pencils) | Mon, 2007-05-28 10:08Hi Forum, This is my first post. I'm currently completing a job that involves a lot of hand drawn illustrations and speech balloons layered in Illustrator CS2. The finished spreads are 550MB in size or so and pretty complex.
I need to supply the artwork as a flat Tiff file and usually this is a very simple process of exporting as a 600 dpi tiff file. I'm not quite sure what has changed this time around, but the tiff files are not appearing as they should.
The Illustrator file has about 40 linked illustrations. Some are tiff files and some are photoshop eps files because I needed a clipping path in some cases. These eps files are appearing as low resolution in the exported tiff layouts. I have recreated one of the spreads (laboriously) in Photoshop to get around the problem. But the second spread is so complex it will take many hours of work to do this, and I'd rather avoid it!!!
Any ideas? Is this to do with the way I am saving my photoshop eps files? I've never known what the 'flatness device' dialogue box meant that comes up when I save an eps with a clipping path. So this could be the key... Or could it just be that my computer is freaking out at the size of the files?
Cheers you you all. Hope someone can help.
jude66
Commenting on this Forum topic is closed.
The linked EPS files B4 you export.
"These eps files are appearing as low resolution in the exported tiff layouts."
Go to the links palette and choose re-link. When you get the dialog window to choose the new link. Un-check the 'link' check box and it will embed the EPS file. Do this for each one. Make sure your raster effects resolution is up to 600 DPI or else it wont work: Under 'Effect Menu--> Raster Resolutions Settings'
"Try not, Do! or do not, there is no try."
-Yoda
Unless you have a monster machine. . . at LEAST 2 ghz processor, this will be VERY painful to export. . . may not even do it. . .
You COULD after doing that split ALL your items into layers in illustrator an dthe export it as a layered Photoshop file. . . then flatten it in Photoshop and save as a TIFF from Photoshop. . .
might work.
"Try not, Do! or do not, there is no try."
-Yoda
Hi Ian,
Thanks for your help. I thought I had found a solution while I was waiting for somebody to post a response --- I had not thought of placing native Photopshop files with transparent backgrounds into my Illustrator layout. This seemed to work, and had the added advantage of giving me a soft antialiased edge instead of the hard clipping path edge -- which suited parts of the layout, since the design is supposed to have a rough drawn style.
However, when I opened my nearly complete files the next morning, the more complex of the placed images had stripes cut across them where the background showed through. Aside from this my computer was going so slowly, that I suspected disaster loomed. I realised later that Illustrator was taking the larger and more complex of the images with transparent backgrounds and slicing them into sections --- presumably easier for the program to handle. No good for me, as they had holes in them.
Your solution worked well. I replaced the linked images (yet again) with the original eps files and then embedded them. The final spread was 300MB plus -- not quite as large as it had been earlier in the process. And surprisingly it successfully exported photoshop 'layered' file (where some of the layers had been flattened.... ie. ALL of them, ha). just one of the embedded files came out with a hole in it in the photoshop flattened file. I was able to patch it up and all is (I hope) well. I'll find out tomorrow when the client has checked the files.
Many thanks for your help.
jude66
Don't link 'linked' illustrator files in order to keep the eps clipping path (an illustrator file with a placed raster graphic). It will almost never rip correctly.
The great thing about InDesign is it automatically recognizes a clipping path whether the photoshop file is an eps or not. Just place your rasters into InDesign and the problem should go away.
By the way, why tifs an not pdf files?
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust
Hi, thanks for the comments. All is complete. The client will not be linking the Illustrator files to any documents as she will have the tiff files. All nice and flat! However, I'll bear your advice in mind for my own use.
As to the tiff format, I'll ask the client if a pdf is acceptable for future jobs. Do you think saving the file as a high resolution pdf from Illustrator would be the best option? Can I include crop marks etc (outside the page area) if I do this, or will it crop to the edge of the document? (I need the crop marks)
Thanks for the comments.
jude66
Not sure why your client requested 600dpi tiffs as printing can only reproduce up to 300dpi effectively...
I'd use InDesign for the cropping especially if the crop is of rectangular shape. InDesign does this so fast! And, if you export pdfs, they end up being much smaller and you can take advantage of having text as font instead of raster which looks much better when printed too.
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust
The 600 dpi is actually because of the black text in the design. I needed the resolution to make the text look as good as possible (as well as the black line work in the illustrations) but as you say, using fonts instead will work better. I'll try that next time.
jude66
Like I said, unless you provide a file with fonts embedded you won't get the resolution benefit.
It wouldn't matter if you provided a 1200 dpi tifs to your client, a printer can still only print up to 300dpi so the rest of that data is wasted. Not only that, but rasterized text does not print nearly as well as text from a font because fonts are translated to vector information when RIP'ed.
If your client needs to edit your files and then send them to a printer, give them collected indesign files. If not, export a PDF/X-1A file and you're done; you also have file you can probably email with ease. ;)
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust
Why is it that lineart images are usually saved at 1200dpi as against 300dpi if it makes no difference at all? In the settings dialogue boxes for creating pdfs, the controls for downsampling the different raster images seems to indicate that lineart should be dealt with differently (ie. at a higher resolution) than 4 colour or greyscale images.
These things always have me wondering, as I am aware that offset printing takes advantage of 300 dpi only. A seeming contradiction. ??
However, I agree that vector text is far the preferable option.
Incidentally, I don't think these particular files would be emailable as pdfs except as low/medium resolution drafts.each spread is larger than A3 in size and contains a lot of illustration! You mention a PDF/X-1A file. The detail is lost on me. What are all the letters after the PDF?
jude66
Line art can be resized to any size without image degradation. Raster images cannot. You're much better served with fonts by not rasterizing them because vector images are inherently smaller than raster images.
About PDF/X-1a workflow:
http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/pdfs/pdfx.pdf
Basically it's a print standard that optimizes files based on a print vendor's specifications.
I think you're confusing lpi with dpi which are two different standards.
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust
LPI defined:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lines_per_inch
DPI defined:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dots_per_inch
(I'm reading the dpi article now. I think I'm a little misinformed about this as well!)
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Dirt and Rust
Talking about lineart, I was referring to black and white bitmap (raster) images, rather than infinitely resizeable vector art. Typically black and white bitmap images are scanned and saved at higher resolutions. Usually 1200dpi is recommended... however I note from your Wikipedia link that scanning in terms of dpi is a misuse of the measurement! :-)
jude66
Because that would be the only way you would EVER need anything beyond 300dpi! Billboards are usually 600-700 dpi at 1":1' so that when its blown up it doesn't degrade too much. . . Besides no one ever looks at a billboard from half a foot away anyway!
"Try not, Do! or do not, there is no try."
-Yoda
Scanning at 1200spi (samples per inch!) is good because it gives you flexibility, but if you are sending out a large print job to a commercial printer, you are still limited to 300dpi/150lpi because of the fact you're using a printing press.
Laser printers print at a higher lpi/dpi but their drawback is you cannot print high volume jobs with them and they use a lot of ink, proportionally speaking.
All these resolution abbreviations are translations of something else (see the DPI article on wikipedia for LCD screen resolution wtih regard to R G and B values for each 'pixel' and you see what I mean). What matters in the end is the device to which you will end up outputting your job.
More on scanning optimization:
http://www.creativepro.com/story/feature/8009.html
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust
The commercial printers I work with are currently using 200lpi as their standard, so all my tiffs are 400dpi. I don't know where you guys are getting the idea that printing presses can't handle anything finer than 300dpi. Or am I confused, too?
Mara
I think it's just us who are confused...
jude66
Dots per Inch or Pixels per inch (DPI & PPI) measure how many pixels are stored within one inch. SO: with a 72 DPI image that would be 72 pixels for every inch. So if you do the math. a 2 inch rasterised image would be have 144 pixels across.
BUT increase the size of that 2 inch file to 4 inches: you would DOUBLE the distance between the two points BUT the dpi would not INCREASE, you would get the program's attempt to FILL in the missing data: i.e artifacts. Therefore using a 72 DPI file at double the size would look blurry and icky.
That being said: Offset Printers use LPI or Lines per inch, to describe a SCREEN that they are using to make an impression on paper: so a LINE SCREEN of 36 would give you BIG dots for every inch that you are printing, the larger the number line screen the SMALLER the dots impressed on paper: heres a breakdown:
85lpi=170dpi/ppi (Newspaper quality)
150lpi=300dpi/ppi (Magazine quality)
175lpi=350dpi/ppi (ULTRA high glossy trade)
So If your printer is printing a 85 lpi document then you multiply it by 2 to get the resulting DPI/PPI.
When you build RASTER artwork you MUST build it to the DPI that you will finally output (print) to. an 85lpi screen quality document WILL NOT look good in a 150 lpi printing environment at the same size, there will be blurriness and loss of sharpness. Likewise a 350 dpi image would CHOKE an offset printer if he is only printing at 85 lpi, it would be a waste of time.
end of first lesson. LOL ;)
"Try not, Do! or do not, there is no try."
-Yoda
300dpi has been the de facto standard at least since 1996 when I started graphic design. Is your printer a 'direct to plate' vendor?
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust
A great article on creativepro.com about resolution:
http://www.creativepro.com/story/howto/25527.html
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Client: "can you guys make it more like a power-point presentation, you know, with the sliding text stuff and all?" (http://clientcopia.com/quotes.php?id=7)
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Dirt and Rust