I would say to trust the pantone guide for the most accurate representation and follow the advice of your printer, especially if you have never printed anything commercially.

Cool Gray 1U is a pretty light color, and at a 50% screen, your monitor will have a hard time representing it.

The way you're using the Pantone fan is misleading yes. :) Remember that unless you print the actual Pantone color (you have to specifically buy the ink) you are actually printing in CMYK and the results WILL be different.

Why not just screen back K100%? You'll get the same result, only cheaper.

And for heaven's sake don't use your screen to determine what your print colors are going to look like! That's what printer proofs are for (from the actual press run). :)

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Pantone also makes screen guides, which are similar to the fans, but show each color at 100%, 90%, 80%, etc. That would give you the best representation. You should ask your printer if he has one.

I assumed earlier that you were printing with pantone inks, but if you are going with cmyk printing, you will get some shift from that anyway.

We actually will be printing with Pantone inks, I'm just printing on my ink jet at home to compare a few versions.

The job is for 500 business cards so I can't afford to get a printer proof first (I'm starting my business small until I gain some experience!). My other concern about the gray screen is how it will look on top of a vanilla card stock that my client is very attached to. I was considering screening a cool black instead.

I went to a very well-established printer but perhaps I'd better check around town some more since they didn't have any screen guide to show me, just a sample business card.

Thank you both very much.

We actually will be printing with Pantone inks, I'm just printing on my ink jet at home to compare a few versions.

You have A LOT to learn about printing. Please don't tell me you're using your ink jet printer as a pantone color proofer?! Not good.

Remember, color is a very subjective business in itself so don't get too attached to it being 100%, especially if your budget is tight. The best you can probably get at this point, in your budget range, is to get a $35 Iris proof to get a pretty good, but not perfect, approximation of color.

Of course if you're doing those 500 cards on a digital press you could have the print company give you a prelim proof before they do the whole run of 500. They can do that, you know, since that's the benefit of a direct-to-plate digital print machine. :)

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No worries -- I am very well aware that the monitor and printer will look nothing like the Pantone colours. I meant I was comparing my various design ideas, not the colours.

But yeah, I have a lot to learn, like, um, EVERYTHING! My background is in fine art not graphic art or printing and I'm paranoid about ending up with a crappy print job. I'd feel compelled to pay for the cards if they didn't look good and as it is I'm working for free as I don't feel right taking money when I've still got so much to learn. But I digress...

I changed my file to use K100% black for the shadows and screened it down to 20%.

Iris proof? Direct-to plate digital printing? Now I've got to go google these, too, or better yet, hit the library. Thanks Nat. Maybe one day I'll eventually learn enough about all the technical stuff so that I can focus on the artwork again. Wouldn't that be nice?

Good call changing the PMS to a K. Creating shadows out of special PMS inks would usually increase cost for little visual benefit.

To your bigger question... Is the Pantone swatch misleading? Often a designer will use a coated swatchbook and choose an uncoated stock on press (or visa versa) which results in different colors. There are other esoteric issues but mostly if you use a 100% pantone on a relatively white stock and the paper choice matches the swatchbook, you'll be doing pretty darned good. If you want your printer/monitor to match PMS values, this is also very doable, but as you pointed out, not entirely necessary.

Since you are just jumping into the world of printing, maybe you could develop a relationship with a local printer. Most pre-press pros are delighted to have clients who show an interest in their discipline and happily share a wealth of information.

Have fun with your project!

I think I would rather have a solid spot color called out than a screen color. A screen is going to leave a stairstep all around the edges-- not pretty. I think coolgray1 is definitely light enough. It is silly to have nothing but a screen on the plate. Make it solid. If nothing else, have them add some white to the formula. I'm sure they mix their own inks.

If you could let us see the design first. :)

However two things to remember: Depending on paper absorbency ink can appear lighter or darker depending on the stock, this is why your printer SHOULD tell you how to set up the artwork. A good rule of thumb is to allow for at LEAST 5% drop off of color due to absorbency (Others can contest this, but it has worked for me so far especially in BLACK). Another thing is that if you have a gradient (which actually a type of screen) and you use pantone colors, the effect may not be what you expect. A full "screen" (that is a percentage of the color) may print BETTER but again depends on paper stock. :) If you are using Black my experience is to use CMYK black as a percentage. What r the other colors u r using?

"Try not, Do! or do not, there is no try."
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Great information from everyone.

Pokie, what do you mean it will leave a stairstep all around? Also, I don't want to use cool gray 1U anymore because the client is very attached to a cream coloured paper (80lb paper, i think it was laid or perhaps felt weave) which means that the white in the cool gray won't look right -- it would need to be tinted to look like it was a shadow of the cream paper.

Ireid, thanks for the advice. Honestly, if the colour is lighter or darker it's not a big deal as there is no logo involved. In fact I may even recommend that my client drops the other Pantone in favour of CMYK entirely. I have to investigate this more. But the other colour we were thinking of using is 2758U 100% for text (as chosen by the client).

I'm meeting with my client on Wednesday to see if I can talk her into a smooth , white felt weave paper (80lb). It would work better for her design any way.

You want to see the design? Oh, I'm so not ready for that level of criticism! It's for a podcasting production business and the card is supposed to look like an iPod (owner's idea). We're unsure of how literal we want it to look though, as she's worried her idea is too gimmicky. We thought of just offering a hint of an iPod by debossing (de-embossing? whatever...) a screen and the circle on some paper but that was too expensive. I've yet to come up with a design I'm happy with except for a very literal copy of an iPod. I'll be presenting my ideas on Wednesday.

I'm a little mystified why we're considering a pantone for the shadow when cmyk will do just fine?

By the way, make sure you don't put the 'U'ncoated pantone on 'C'oated stock. The color will not be the same as the sample in the pantone book.

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When I met with my friend to discuss her ideas last week we decided to walk the block to a printer to get some information and look at the paper, etc. We hadn't planned on doing this so I hadn't done very much research yet on offset printing. We told the printer we needed the gray for a shadow on the cream paper and she suggested 8 U, i think. I have since learned that the expert we asked to speak to is actually a computer operator. Needless to say, I'm not impressed and won't be returning there.

The paper IS uncoated -- I knew that one all on my own. :)

Yeah, I already advised her about the copyright issue. It's a new small business though, so I think she's decided to risk it for the time being.

Hmm .... okay, I'll post some of my designs tomorrow afternoon/evening, but ONLY because you can't bite over the internet...

Apple has become notorious for defending its copyrights and patents. Even ipodlounge.com has a reworked almost ipod logo but not quite to avoid infringement...

What's JCL and DB2 code?

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Powerpoint is not a design application
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