WebCoffee - website critique
Pedro_Manchini (10 points) | Sat, 2008-11-08 14:51Hello guys,
I have recently launched my online portfolio + a small blog of mine. Would be happy to hear any of your critique either here or on the page itself. I wanted it to be fresh so therefore went for this colorful concept. Still looking for any possible improvement ideas:
Please be free to comment also any of the work showcase in the portfolio section.
Thanks, P
Commenting on this Image is closed.
I think it's nice. I have a feeling certain elements don't fit exactly together for some reason, but I can't put my finger on it. It feels like a movie set made up of old movie sets from different decades or something.
I like the colorful spiral smoke, but really, cigarette? It's 2008, mate!
One thing that I noticed right off is that the text on the egg needs to conform to the shape of the egg, or your concept doesn't work.
Mara
I agree with Mara, I think it looks OK as is, but would feel more "right" if it had a slight downward curve to set off the shape of the egg.
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
Looks like the cigarette is what's going on here. To be honest, I was not thinking about it that much when building the concept. It surely is not ment to be a smoking propaganda. It just goes to my mind, when I do imagine the coffee and its process of drinking (could be seen in a totally different way for a smoker and a non-smoker).
One fact is telling me, that even in 2008, the world still smokes. Why to close the eyes then? It surely is a bad thing, but that's what all of us know. Another one to point out, that this graphics on the screen is not harming you in any way. It's not like sitting next to the smoker; this is gonna be the main problem until a complete cigarette ban, when talking about the smoking dilemma.
Maybe I could refer to this problem in a naive way of putting a cross over the fag...
My real concern is. . .nothing in this image says coffee. I know you're not selling it, but I would at least reference it, since you're playing on that. I see the small amount of coffee below the rainbow after looking at it for a while, but it's not even noticable at one or two glances.
Also, this is more out of curiosity -- but why did you choose the theme "A blog by a coffee lover"? This is not meant to be condescending, but a huge number of people drink and/or love coffee (including myself). What makes that special? What makes me want to read your design blog over someone else's who prefers tea? I guess I just don't understand the concept.
With that being said, I agree -- the hand with the cigarette is the -most- prominent. This is because of both vertical and size hierarchy. If you really like the graphic enough to use it in almost every avatar on your site, you should probably consider a new domain name.
In addition, cafeteria does not come to mind at all when I see a cigarette. I think of cigarettes.
I agree with Mara about conforming the text around the egg. You also might want to decide what is most important for people to look at. The following (in my opinion) are competing for attention: "the born", "of", ".eu", "Web coffee is a blog", "by a coffee lover", "and a graphic designer". My suggestion is to only bold things that are actually important to read so people will keep reading.
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My Portfolio
Monty Pythonish and I'm really not minding it all.
Few options you might like to consider:
- replace the female's hand with a greasy, hairy male hand yet still tilted at the same elegant angle AND with the nails still coated with red nail polish
- try losing the coffee background and slap a mug handle on the side of the egg
- I like the red sportscar but would have the white clouds coming out its exhaust...the enviro-friendly auto
my two cents.
Nice beginning. Like the overall clean look.
"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible."
— Frank Zappa
"Art -- the one achievement of Man which has made the long trip up from all fours seem well advised." - James Thurber
I think Monty Python is a good comparison as well, now that 3dog mentions it. The rainbow and other little bits of things popping out of an egg (instead of a flip-top head).
I like the colored smoke, the rainbow etc, but it's all kind of confusing. too many small contrasting elements crowded together up there. the colored smoke actually made the cigarette hard for me to distinguish at first, but once I realized what it is I found it difficult to look beyond it. The car looks out of place and even knowing what the piece is for, I can't find the relevance for the car. Coffee, designers, and deadlines go together and the egg and rainbow represent birth/creation...
The yellow in the rainbow makes my eyes want to stay up there and decipher the images at the top rather than move on down to the text below. additionally once I get down there, the magenta text is stronger than the black text making the black text almost unnoticable.
In this case, the images are all only supposed to support the text, which is your message. Instead they take over.
I think if you figure out a way to knock back the dominance of the images, the text on the Egg will take the driver's seat as it should. you can clean up the bottom items by saying instead "WebCoffee is a blog/ by a coffee loving designer" and make those two phrases dominant but let the rest be an after-thought, like it is now, but strenghten the effect.
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
What do you mean by "check out the born of webcoffee.eu"? What exactly is "the born of"? Do you mean to say "check out the birth of webcoffee"? That might make sense, but with the text as it is now, it doesn't make sense to me.
Yep, should be "birth" not "born".
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Natobasso
dirtandrust.com
"Powerpoint is not a design application"
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Dirt and Rust
My conclusion here is as follows:
1. The fag
Maybe it really is too subjective point of view. Even I have heard also some positive words, I will consider the brush as a solid replacement. It is still rolling in my head though. Since WebCoffe is not a company name, just a webspace, I may come up with some pre-page seperator, where the user can choose if he prefers the smoking or a non-smoking area (because I still think that lots of people smoke when having a coffee). The smoking could be left as it is, the non-smoking could present a brush. But then I need to remake category icons.
2. Posted image
I agree with most of you, that the image posted is sewn with a hot needle. Was doing it in quite a rush and didn't pay much of attention to the typography work. I don't have that much a problem with the egg message, but now I see, the addition on the bottom is totally messed up with the use of magenta.
3.Grammar
As you have surely noticed, I am not a native english speaker, so it is not that easy for me to see any difference between born x birth. This is not the kind of project I would be hiring a translator for.
4. Thanks
Gotta be thankful to steph and walks, who gave me the most constructive feedback. Don't know what kind of guy 3dog is, but looking at his home page makes me feel like trashing the whole concept and switching it to a big christmas tree. Anyway. Thanks to all of ya for commenting!
4. 3dog is a female and still needing to learn how to design for the web, as I've mentioned a countless number of times on this blog. However, the criticism was not about my work, but yours. When I'm ready for others to critique my site I will post it. Until then, concentrate on your own plate and leave mine to me.
"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible."
— Frank Zappa
"Art -- the one achievement of Man which has made the long trip up from all fours seem well advised." - James Thurber
I can see this thread building up to a shouting match and that's not necessary.
We post in critique to learn from each other.
Critique is supposed to be the hard truth, if we wanted to be told it's great even though it's not, we'd just ask our families what they think and get a warm, fuzzy, pat on the back.
However Critique does not have to be done unkindly either. Critique is supposed to be clinical observations that include both positive and negative points. In art class, we were supposed to find both, even go out of our way to be sure we had an even number of both. I've noticed that none of us really do that here. Suggestions should be presented in a way that leaves the artist in control, give reasons that present your way of looking at it, try not to impose your own creativity onto their project.
for example, I suggested that a brush could replace the cigarette... I should not have been so specific, since any number of other objects could also replace it, the brush is my idea. Instead I should have suggested replacing it with an object of artistic nature and let the artist think of something.
The other thing is, nothing says that suggestions absolutely have to be carried out. It's still the artist's discretion. Hopefully the artist knows the customer well enough to know what they will accept, we don't know your customer at all.
The artist is also free to defend their ideas, and should. Maybe someone else will learn to see their own work differently. Remember some of us are complete amatures, while others have been doing this a long time. Either way, psychology is a changing world and older people tend to get set in their ways, while younger people tend to think they can redesign the wheel. so you have to look at the advice clinically as well, and pick what makes sense from it.
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
Don't woah me; I'm not a horse. And it wasn't the beginnings of a shouting match. I was just letting junior know that the jab at my site was not necessary nor appreciated. If he really wants to try something christmasy, why not have Mr. Hanky dead nuts center with 3 Shits Sailing in?
"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible."
— Frank Zappa
"Art -- the one achievement of Man which has made the long trip up from all fours seem well advised." - James Thurber
We're all horses at heart, just let me roam the green fields, and throw me some apples once in a while and I would be right at home :)
I'm struggling not to go view your site now to see what he was talking about, and it's not easy, the curiosity is killing me
is it possible it wasn't an attack on your site and he was refering to rebuilding his own? I really don't see a reason for him to attack you
ROTFL...~Mr Hanky~
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
I think it's possible that your being too sensitive, Wendy, because Your site design is beautiful. my only suggestion is to remove the construction sign, search engines subtract relevency points from sites with construction signs, so if anyone searches your area for graphic artists, someone whose site does not have a construction disclaimer would appear on the searchlist before yours does. If you're the only one that might be fine, but if there are 30 graphic artists nearby...
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
A sensitive female? Never heard of the likes. ;)
Thanks for your comments walksin2trees, but that was just a 10 minute jobby illustration I did up as a placement for now until I can get my real site put together and up. Reminds me, though, I still need to change the tel number. I'm in a different area code and believe me, where I work from I'd be surprised if there were another two nearby designers, let alone another one. Not unless the black bears and moose are secretly running a shop nearby... Yogi and Bullmoose Graphics. UNDERCUTTING BASTARDS!!!!
"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible."
— Frank Zappa
"Art -- the one achievement of Man which has made the long trip up from all fours seem well advised." - James Thurber
I thought that might be the case, but I don't know enough about canadian geography to be able to guess how rural you might be... I know there are remote places up there, but I wasn't about to assume you lived in one of them :)
Give Yoggi and Boo Boo my regards... and save me a picnic basket!
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
I got your point about the replace, I'll make a deeper analysis and hopefully come up with a usable solution...
1.The fag:
the easist solution is to find something that appeals to both rather than have a seperate site for each. Remember, your site is not about smoking, so don't let yourself get stuck on that aspect of your design. Boil it down to the simple message and make sure that everything supports that message, if anything doesn't, it's expendable. My brother is a smoker too, and he tells me that smoking becomes a reason for everything. He only buys as much gas as it will take for him to get to the store the next day... why not fill it I asked... answer: "because that way I'll have to stop for smokes" so I know it's hard for you to seperate the smoking from coffee, because for you, you don't have one without the other.
3.Grammar: Grammar is always important for a professional. but that was the only grammar mistake so don't feel insulted, instead be glad you found out before it went live.
4. Thanks:
Not everyone has had the opportunity to learn how to Critique. I've learned that not all art schools teach critique, this amazes me because I learned it in Highschool. Anyone that hasn't gone to an artschool but maybe learned design on the job may never have had the experience either.
Usually, I have a hard time getting a good critique because many people don't want to hurt my feelings. I have had my designs here and gotten very bad feedback. some I agreed with and felt silly for even posting it afterwards, while for my last post, I challenged most of the suggestions in an attempt to force better reasons to make the suggested changes.
I look forward to seeing how this turns out, post again after your next series of edits :)
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
You make good points (not just here, but in all your posts -- so glad you're here). You've triggered a forum topic, so off I go to post it.
Mara
I agree, walks got the brains on the right place. More of those people should be talking.
the job is for, grammar is ALWAYS important. And as a side note, show a little respect for the people critiquing your stuff will ya? ;)
Leaky Penny
www.leakypenny.com
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~ Angela Bassett
Leaky Penny
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Quite so. The problem here (born versus birth) is that born is not a noun. Although born and birth concern the same things, you want a verb in your sentence. It should read, "Check into the birth of....
Mara
ps: Don't confuse "born" (past tense verb, as in "he was born") with "borne" (adverb as in "we were borne away to another realm by the sheer transcendence of the music") or an old-timey noun spelled "bourne" (as in "That far country from whose bourne no traveller returns"). Lately, "birth" (like gift) is sometimes used (cringe-worthily) as a verb, as in "she birthed a baby boy" or adjective, as in "birth clinic" (or the variant "birthing" as in "birthing coach").
I sure am glad I was born into an English-speaking life, because it must be absolute hell to try to learn it as a second langauge. It makes no sense even to me sometimes. I stand in awe of my fellow creatives around the world who post here in English, often more articulately than most native English speakers. :-)
Mara
A propos nothing in particular, and for the benefit of non-Americans (I'm so tempted to spell Ahmurrikuns until Jan. 20) "fag" is more commonly used in the U.S. as a derogatory term for gay men. It's a pretty tired old term, though, so chances are a lot of younger people wouldn't immediately react to it in that context, unless they were gay and knew their gay social history.
All right, now. Don't everybody say "gay social history means fabulous antique map serving trays from Crate & Barrel" all at once.
Mara
that term threw me for a loop when I first saw it, but I figured it out soon enough.
"...and mamma cried: Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow" - Frank Zappa
Whenever I see the word "fag" it brings to mind something my grandmother once said to me.
"Honey, I remember when a fag was something you smoked, a joint was a place you walked into, and coke was something you drank out of a bottle."
;| Gotta love granny. 84 this year and still running hard.
"Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible."
— Frank Zappa
"Art -- the one achievement of Man which has made the long trip up from all fours seem well advised." - James Thurber
Otherwise, I will have to agree with others comments regarding the "fag" (i.e. cigarette). I think if it were the 1950s, it would work, or if the Marlboro Man was smoking a cigarette and drinking his coffee while sitting atop his horse, then maybe. But not in 2008.
Sorry.
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"I am not sick. I am broken. But I am happy as long as I can paint." ~ Frida Kahlo
www.onegirlcreative.com